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 Post subject: SkyOS GUI R&D Conceptual Tests
PostPosted: April 19th, 2005, 10:47 pm 
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Test builds of some of the SkyOS GUI theme and interaction improvements we've been making are now internally available. We're working hard on improvement, and would like feedback on the current revisions which have been made.

Image

Here's what you see (and don't):

Window interaction: To resize a window in SkyOS, the user pulls the well defined tab in the lower right-hand corner. The borders around the windows no longer resize the window, but move it, as does the titlebar. The minimize button has been removed and it's function replaced by click patterns. Double clicking a window will minimize it to the taskbar. Double right-clicking a window will maximize it. Etc.

WindUI: The theme has had much-needed changes applied. Everything you see in that picture has been or is ready to be implemented; nothing is photoshopped beyond the capability of SkyOS. Corners are now antialiased, and anisotropic gaussian shadows which are almost exact to MacOSX's encompass each window, substantially improving upon the previous shadows. Buttons are positioned symmetrically--close on left, maximize on right--for a more aesthetically pleasing and productive UI.

Again, feedback is welcome and encouraged. Not all changes are final--your say will dictate what of this stays and what changes--so please, comment.

Edit: "close on left, minimize on right" -> "close on left, maximize on right"

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Last edited by Alex Forster on May 3rd, 2005, 4:53 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: April 19th, 2005, 10:55 pm 
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I like it all except for the buttons and click patterns.

I am still all for keeping the 3 buttons on the right side, double click titlebar = maximise.. double right click = minimise.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: April 19th, 2005, 10:56 pm 
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are we going to see scroll bars with proper arrows at each end?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: April 19th, 2005, 10:58 pm 
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"The minimize button has been removed..."

"Buttons are positioned symmetrically--close on left, minimize on right--"

Uhm..?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: April 19th, 2005, 11:00 pm 
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Anyways, how hard is it to implement the click patterns? Can it i.e. be included in one of the betas, and then throw a public poll? It's hard to know whether or not it works without trying it.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: April 19th, 2005, 11:01 pm 
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runevi wrote:
Anyways, how hard is it to implement the click patterns? Can it i.e. be included in one of the betas, and then throw a public poll? It's hard to know whether or not it works without trying it.
[15:58] Patrick: Hey, could you send me the theme that alex just posted? I would like to give it a test run to see how I like it
[15:59] Chris Marshall: Sorry can't at the moment, it is requires a later version of SkyOS than is available at the moment
[16:00] Patrick: ah cuz of the shadows? or the whole windui?
[16:00] Chris Marshall: The theming engine has changed,

I wanted to test it but i cant ATM. Hope you dont mind that I posted that chris


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: April 19th, 2005, 11:05 pm 
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patrickweber wrote:
runevi wrote:
Anyways, how hard is it to implement the click patterns? Can it i.e. be included in one of the betas, and then throw a public poll? It's hard to know whether or not it works without trying it.
[15:58] Patrick: Hey, could you send me the theme that alex just posted? I would like to give it a test run to see how I like it
[15:59] Chris Marshall: Sorry can't at the moment, it is requires a later version of SkyOS than is available at the moment
[16:00] Patrick: ah cuz of the shadows? or the whole windui?
[16:00] Chris Marshall: The theming engine has changed,

I wanted to test it but i cant ATM. Hope you dont mind that I posted that chris


A little late to ask isn't it????? :lol:

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: April 20th, 2005, 1:04 am 
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The symmetry/mouse moves require the user to not only think before moving their mouse to perform their action, but also makes moving and managing windows more tedious, as the controls for them are not only seperated on oposite sides of the screen, but are also different (maximise is a different action from minimise, while closing and minimising are on all the way across the screen from each other).

Apple and Microsoft have it right, group the together. Easy, simple.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: April 20th, 2005, 1:16 am 
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Proph3t wrote:
The symmetry/mouse moves require the user to not only think before moving their mouse to perform their action, but also makes moving and managing windows more tedious, as the controls for them are not only seperated on oposite sides of the screen, but are also different (maximise is a different action from minimise, while closing and minimising are on all the way across the screen from each other).

Apple and Microsoft have it right, group the together. Easy, simple.
Amen to that :). Plus when the window is maximised you have to move your mouse all the way across the screen to minise or close it which gets very annoying.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: April 20th, 2005, 2:28 am 
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patrickweber wrote:
Plus when the window is maximised you have to move your mouse all the way across the screen to minise or close it which gets very annoying.

Just want to point out that no matter where on the window border you put the buttons, you'll always have to move your mouse all the way across the screen to get to it. ;)

But yes, I think that the suite of buttons should all be together (Or you could put them on the bottom! Down the right hand side! Whatever!), so that when you have multiple windows open, you can go through them all, closing or minimizing based on which you want to keep, without moving back and forth across the screen.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: April 20th, 2005, 3:44 am 
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Tom wrote:
patrickweber wrote:
Plus when the window is maximised you have to move your mouse all the way across the screen to minise or close it which gets very annoying.

Just want to point out that no matter where on the window border you put the buttons, you'll always have to move your mouse all the way across the screen to get to it. ;)

But yes, I think that the suite of buttons should all be together (Or you could put them on the bottom! Down the right hand side! Whatever!), so that when you have multiple windows open, you can go through them all, closing or minimizing based on which you want to keep, without moving back and forth across the screen.


or just give us expose....


I do like the symmetry. I think it is very important to be symmetric because it is aethetically pleasing... i.e. the reason why many people like MacOS so much is because of it's aesethically pleasing GUI.

Also, if the window is already maximized, double left clicking should also be able to minimize it too.

Another cool idea, when you resize the window using the triangle corner, it should be able to "snap" onto the screen border or another window. I haven't seen that idea done on any other OS.

Now that you have cool shadows, maybe you can take the MacOS approach to boarders.... i.e. don't have any borders; use the shadows as the borders for the windows. It look's good, and actually save's some screen space. Maybe two different themes, one with the border running along the left and right and another without it?

i've mentioned this elsewhere (maybe in that thread that got closed) but i also like the MacOS idea of maximizing, i.e. it only maximizes the window to the space it needs... again this is a cool space saving feature and saves you effort from having to manually size the window to it's contents. (Useful for web developers with multiple windows).

One last thing... Please, please, please, let's get some color in the theme. I see grey, on grey, on grey, on grey.... :)

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: April 20th, 2005, 4:28 am 
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Even if you decide to keep the borders on the left and right, I think they need to be quite a bit smaller, they look so big to me. (I know they are meant to be grabbed from either side, but how often will you use that instead of the top?)

Instead, I'd say get rid of the borders and let shadows take over. It helps show them off a little bit more. As for the missing moving functions... let the user click and drag the unused background space of the application, but give it about a .3-.5 second delay before allowing it to be dragged. This is alot how iTunes and MSN Messenger (on Windows with the Title-Bar hidden) work. That would make it easier to move the window and also reduce screen clutter.

As for the maximize and minimize functions, on OSX the maximize function is hardly ever used, and minimize is given an icon even though the gesture is there too. I think taking the minimize button away will make it harder for users to migrate to SkyOS without learning to adapt. For some people (we're talking general public), they like things to be obvious to them. I think we need a minimize button more than a maximize button.

For that matter, you could put a button in all four corners of the window to be symmetrical. (The maximize button doesn't need to be a button, it can be in the same style as the resize handle, so that it's more subtle and doesn't look out of place.)
Code:
[X] ---------- [ Title ] ------------ [_]
|                                     |
|                                     |
[M] ==================================[//]

X = Close
_ = Minimize
M = Maximize
// = Resize


Just some random thoughts. As unoften as the maximize button is used, and since the functions are similar, they could be grouped together at the bottom. And close and minimize have similar functions (hiding the window) so they are grouped at the top.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: April 20th, 2005, 5:13 am 
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ok heres my idea
Code:
-------------------Title------------[-]-[X]
|                                        |
|                                        |
|                                        |
|----------------------------------------|

ok
[X] = close, which is on the right
[-] = minamizse, which is on the the right to
Title = maxamize, which can max and restore, using a double left click
Title = collapse, which means the window will collapse to only the title bar showing, using the middle click or scroll click

for moving the window around you will need to click and hold the left mouse button on the title bar, then you can move it around.

For resizing the window all you need to do is left click and hold a side of the window.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: April 20th, 2005, 6:06 am 
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HecHacker1 wrote:
Tom wrote:
patrickweber wrote:
Plus when the window is maximised you have to move your mouse all the way across the screen to minise or close it which gets very annoying.

Just want to point out that no matter where on the window border you put the buttons, you'll always have to move your mouse all the way across the screen to get to it. ;)

But yes, I think that the suite of buttons should all be together (Or you could put them on the bottom! Down the right hand side! Whatever!), so that when you have multiple windows open, you can go through them all, closing or minimizing based on which you want to keep, without moving back and forth across the screen.


or just give us expose....


I do like the symmetry. I think it is very important to be symmetric because it is aethetically pleasing... i.e. the reason why many people like MacOS so much is because of it's aesethically pleasing GUI.

Also, if the window is already maximized, double left clicking should also be able to minimize it too.

Another cool idea, when you resize the window using the triangle corner, it should be able to "snap" onto the screen border or another window. I haven't seen that idea done on any other OS.

Now that you have cool shadows, maybe you can take the MacOS approach to boarders.... i.e. don't have any borders; use the shadows as the borders for the windows. It look's good, and actually save's some screen space. Maybe two different themes, one with the border running along the left and right and another without it?

i've mentioned this elsewhere (maybe in that thread that got closed) but i also like the MacOS idea of maximizing, i.e. it only maximizes the window to the space it needs... again this is a cool space saving feature and saves you effort from having to manually size the window to it's contents. (Useful for web developers with multiple windows).

One last thing... Please, please, please, let's get some color in the theme. I see grey, on grey, on grey, on grey.... :)
Yeah I like expose.. thatd be cool if we got some sort of expose clone.. actually I got an idea.. lemme animate it in flash..

Ok forget that.. but what my idea is is like an Alt+Tab alternate but similar.. all the windows become smaller thumbnails and they slide on and off screen everytime you press alt tab adn then once the window you want is on screen you let go and it comes into focus. While the whole time that that is happening the background is still visible but is darkened. It might be too hard without 3d drivers but its an idea just the same.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: April 20th, 2005, 6:30 am 
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So you want symettry, but your example (MacOS) doesnt use symettry?

Symettry is appealing to the eye maybe, but not always functional. In this case, it reduces way to much functionality I believe. Evidently, so do the top paid and smartest interface designers in the world (Apple/Microsoft's employee's).


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